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Hergé’s instruction not to continue Tintin

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Revercub24
Member
#1 · Posted: 1 Mar 2009 17:56
Since tracking down and joining this site I've discovered, from other posts, that Hergé left instructions regarding the continuity of his works: there should be no more Tintin adventures by other writers or artists.'

I'm a little confused by this. What about the Tintin film The Lake of Sharks and all the other films? What about fan fiction and fan art and icons?

If we do any of these things are we in fact betraying these instructions even though we just mean to pay our respects?
Amilah
Member
#2 · Posted: 1 Mar 2009 18:38 · Edited by: Moderator
The films were made while Hergé was alive. The newer series or incoming movies and not "new adventures", but faithful(-lish) transpositions of his stories.
mct16
Member
#3 · Posted: 1 Mar 2009 19:44
What about "Tintin in the New World" by Frederic Tuten? That was published in 1993. Does anyone know how Tuten managed to get permission to publish that? I would have thought that Herge's instructions would have applied to novels as well as comics.
Mikael Uhlin
Member
#4 · Posted: 1 Mar 2009 21:36
From what I've heard, while Hergé was still alive he gave Tuten a special permission to write that book.
Revercub24
Member
#5 · Posted: 1 Mar 2009 23:34
I'm guessing that with Tintin, we have to take what we can get. But it's Herge's work; he holds the final right because he created it.

And anyway, we have twenty-four lovely adventures, a cartoon series and an upcoming film series. What could be better?
NikkiRoux
Member
#6 · Posted: 8 Mar 2009 14:18
Revercub24:
And anyway, we have twenty-four lovely adventures, a cartoon series and an upcoming film series. What could be better?

Yes, and we have this site, too, where we could put forward our ideas and opinions. Don't forget imagination. We might not be allowed to write fanfiction, but we could still make it up in our minds, yes?
Revercub24
Member
#7 · Posted: 9 Mar 2009 14:39 · Edited by: Moderator
Do you think we ought to warn [link removed] about this? They actually have a Tintin catergory and people are contributing.

Moderator Note: While your intention is no doubt laudable, mentioning where to find unofficial material is against the forum rules, and should be avoided. Please do not do so again - many thanks!
As for advising other sites on their policies, it certainly isn't something which the Tintinologist Team could become involved in: working to keep these forums within our understanding of the legislation is quite enough, without overseeing other people's sites too.
It is best to assume that a site such as you mentioned is more than likely aware of the legality or otherwise of what they are doing, and have their own thoughts on the matter.
The Tintinologist Team
Whistler
Member
#8 · Posted: 6 Aug 2009 04:44
Hmm...when I think of fanfiction, I do always wonder what he would say about it. Perhaps if he had died in these times, he'd have a slightly different view of it, perhaps he wouldn't.

I do agree with you, I don't think he would really be very angry about it, he might actually be flattered. But, fanfiction/fanart/etc. is such a messy topic what would and wouldn't be allowed is never clear. Some may bring up the argument that he meant that it wasn't to be used for profit, or to be published. Perhaps he did, perhaps he didn't.

That and it's all but impossible to regulate fanworks. Take a look at any artist/fan/internet site site, and you'll find the Tintin fanworks up in the thousands! Most if not all of these people don't even know about Herge's instructions.

As for me? All my fanfiction is on my computer, off the internet, I'm just to embarrassed to show them :)
number1fan
Member
#9 · Posted: 6 Aug 2009 10:53
His wishes should be respected - no one should tamper with the books that he wrote.
A great thing would be if there could be an "Inspired by Hergé" company, that allows the use of fan-art and new books by other artists.
There have been countless versions of Sherlock Holmes from America to Russia, and the same with Mickey Mouse and Popeye ("Ak! Ak! Ak! Ak!"), which have not tarnished their reputations at all.
These wishes have been broken all ready: Hergé wasn't alive to supervise the making of the television series in 1990. Therefore isn't someone just using Tintin?
Conan Doyle is not around to supervise the new Sherlock Holmes film that comes out in December. I have heard he had the same wishes as Hergé, though I cant prove this.
If his wishes were kept, why all the resin models, and the Pixi series should not be done. Moulinsart rake in the pennies, making huge amounts of money from a poor dead man's name.
I know it all may seem fun, but if Moulinsart continue to do things like this why can't people who have been truly inspired by this be allowed to release artwork?
It's a shame because Moulinsart would make a lot of money out of this, which is something they like doing.
jock123
Moderator
#10 · Posted: 6 Aug 2009 15:02 · Edited by: jock123
Whistler:
Hmm...when I think of fanfiction, I do always wonder what he would say about it.

You’re sort of suggesting that this is a new thing, which it isn’t.
Hergé was well aware of “fan art” etc., as he was sent it - mainly through the Tintin magazine, as far as I can tell. Sometimes it would even get printed in the pages of the journal.
The main difference is that, a) he was alive to give his permission (and in the case of the Journal it may not even have been him who had the last word, as the publishers had some rights in the character granted through their contract with Hergé), and b) his stipulation was that there was to be no more Tintin after he died.

As a) no longer applies, and b) is in effect, that sort of answers the question.

As I understand it, he tended to be flattered that someone would bother to draw his characters, but was not keen about it happening, per se; furthermore, he used to ask why they didn’t just apply themselves to creating original characters and situations of their own?

It seems to make sense; I mean, if Hergé had taken the same approach, we’d just have a lot of Zig & Puce fan-fic from Hergé, and no Tintin!

Whistler:
That and it's all but impossible to regulate fanworks. Take a look at any artist/fan/internet site site, and you'll find the Tintin fanworks up in the thousands!

I’m not sure what you are getting at here: thousands of cars are stolen every day, but I don’t see that as a reason to abandon notions of ownership and personal property.
Whistler:
Most if not all of these people don't even know about Herge's instructions.

Even if Hergé hadn’t made such a direct request, that doesn’t mean that anyone has the right to use the characters for their own ends.
number1fan:
There have been countless remakes of Sherlock Holmes from America to Russia

And they have had to be made with permission if still in copyright! The last Conan Doyle stories went out of copyright in the U.K. in 2000, but The Casebook of Sherlock Holmes won’t be out of copyright in the U.S. until 2016, possibly 2023 (I’ve no idea what might cause the extension, but it is possible due to one of the stories contained in it having a later copyright date).

Representatives of the now deceased (but alive at the time) Dame Jean Conan-Doyle (who inherited the rights in the character) successfully claimed against Paramount for the use of Moriarty and Holmes on Star Trek: The Next Generation.

Of course, once the rights have ended, there is nothing to stop the creation of new works without any permission.
number1fan:
I have heard he had the same wishes as Hergé though i cant prove this.

There never seem to have been any strictures on this, to be honest, and his estate have long authorized new works, on radio and in print initially.

Popeye is an interesting one; although he seems fairly “modern”, compared to ACD and Holmes (and in fact appeared in January 1929 the same month that Tintin debuted), the original drawings of Popeye are all now in the public domain in the EU, Elzie Seegar having died very young in 1938, a mere eight years after Conan Doyle.

In the US the copyright in these drawings doesn’t expire until 2024. Furthermore, King Features Syndicate own the Popeye trademark, and that will last beyond the copyright.

So while in the EU you can use Seegar images on t-shirts and postcards and whatever of your own devising, even write your own Popeye strips, you can’t currently do so in the US, and wherever you are you will have to wait longer to produce “Popeye” brand spinach without KFS breathing down your neck. No wonder lawyers make money, eh?

To add just another wrinkle, there apparently is a chain of diners called “Popeye’s” in the U.S. This is named after the character “Popeye” Doyle (no relation to Sir Arthur and Dame Jean!) in The French Connection - a character apparently nicknamed for “Popeye the Sailor Man”!

number1fan:
if Moulinsart continue to do things like this why can't people who have been truly inspired by this be allowed to realease artwork.

As has been said elsewhere before: Moulinsart don’t have the right to authorize new work!
They are a company which has the right to exploit the works of Hergé to make money for the foundation, which is a charity. They derive that right from Mme Rodwell, and it is she as Hergé’s heir who enacts his wish for there to be no new stories, however she chooses to interpret that.

Moulinsart can’t themselves do anything about that, one way or the other.

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